Kasparov: I feel that it's my obligation to tell people in the civilized world what is happening in Russia
Kasparov has ruled the chess world for more than a decade, and during his reign has developed a reputation as a fighter - both for his battles over a chess board and with the world chess federation, FIDE.
More recently, his unsuccessful face-off against the IBM-designed Deep Blue super computer ended in controversy when Kasparov stormed away from the match. He claims Deep Blue was a fraud - a puppet manipulated by human masters. In the meantime, IBM has dismantled Deep Blue.
Away from chess, Kasparov has been active on a number of other fronts. A native of Azerbaijan, Kasparov continues to live in Moscow, and is a frequent - and very public - commentator on Russia's political and economic dramas. He has also been advising international banking houses on developments in Russia. For some time, he appeared publicly to be flirting with greater involvement in politics - he has been an open supporter of nationalist politician Gen. Alexander Lebed - but now says he has changed his mind. Last week, Kasparov shared some of his thoughts on Russia, its politicians and reformers, and his life above the chess board with Prague Business Journal reporter (and chess know-nothing) Hana Le‰enarová. Following are excerpts of their conversation.
Q: In a recent Wall Street Journal article you compared Russian President Boris Yeltsin's government and the oligarchy to Al Capone & Co. Do you think that since you are who you are, you can get away with it?
A: No, I feel that it's my obligation to tell people in the civilized world what is happening in Russia. I did it 10 years ago, when Mikhail Gorbachev was begging for money and many people in the West were so charmed by him. And I had my reputation, I was already a world champion, and I was known as a proponent of democracy ... That's when I began writing. Now you have the so-called young reformers, who are selling the bullshit in the West that Russia is underway to reform and if you have these guys it will change. They say: Reforms are stolen in Russia; Russia now is on the way back. I am going to continue asking the same questions. And I believe that my articles would help Russian people because it will probably shorten the time of these crooks in power.
Q: What's your projection for Russia?
A: I think that it will happen by default. Because there is one good thing about what happened: There is no one else to blame. And I think the key basic problem was that they were portraying themselves as Democrats. Yeltsin and (former Prime Minister Viktor) Chernomyrdin and the clique - they did such a bad service to democracy. To the whole name. When you say democrat in Russia, people go grrrr (snarls like an angry dog). Because they associate it with those who were enriching themselves by robbing the whole country.
Q: What about all these former communists who are in the new Yevgeny Primakov government?
A: Now, they have to face a dilemma. Because these communists, these are not winning-type communists. They are cruel, but they are not brutal and they are not enemies. They have bank accounts in the West, they have a very different perspective.
Q: Where do you think is a safe place to keep your money?
A: Obviously, even New York is not the safest place, but again you can lose money in New York, in London, or Switzerland. But at least you know the rules and you can make some predictions. In Russia, whoever owes money, just because there is a new guy in the Kremlin, can simply default on all his obligations. And you know, I'm a chess player; I'm not a poker player. I have to count on some rules, then I can make predictions.
Q: What did you think of the financial community's excitement about Russia recently?
A: I think eventually Russia will have to consider a way to pay (its debts) back, but it's a question of correctly projected international pressure. There is a problem that Western leaders are too opportunistic.
Q: Well, what should they do? What kind of pressure are you talking about?
A: First of all, I don't think they should feel blackmailed by the nuclear threat. That's a very important point.
Q: You don't see that as anything the world should be worried about?
A: I think that the West should recognize that they are still dealing with people who are not serious negotiators. They can deny any deal, if such is the party line today. Party line, oligarchy line, tycoons' line, whatever you name it. They have a class interest, an interest in the elite and from their point of view, that's superior to any international criticisms ... And you have (former Prime Minister Sergei) Kiriyenko and you have (former Deputy Prime Minister Yegor) Gaidar to make declarations - one to Russians, one to the foreigners. And then they are replaced.
Q: Who do you consider an ideal politician to run Russia?
A: You don't have one. I am not an optimist. But I like Boris Fyodorov very much. He has been my personal friend for many years, and he is well placed; he is in the tax office ... He is young, experienced in the West, but the time for his generation hasn't come yet. You still have Yeltsin, Chernomyrdin, Primakov. They simply don't understand the elementary roots of the economy. They believe that two-times-two depends on the decision of the central committee or government or whatever.
Q: What about your plans to go into politics? Is that still an issue?
A: It's the least-productive area. I think that I can play chess, I can write articles, I can make some good assessments. But I should stay away from politics in Russia ... I declined a few times a proposition to run for Parliament.
Q: Well, let's assume you keep your job. Do you still have fun doing it?
A: It's work. It's creative work, and I need it for my soul satisfaction. Everything that I do is enhanced while I'm playing chess. But of course during this match I spent too much time watching CNN: Mr. Primakov and Mr. Clinton. But watching Clinton is for fun, watching Primakov is not for fun.
Q: What's your recipe for Primakov now?
A: I think transparency is the key factor. There is no single economy that will succeed unless there is transparency - whether it's Japan, South Korea, Indonesia - it would blow up. Most successful economies are the ones with transparent political and social systems ... where people can know whatever their president is doing.
Q: During the Deep Blue match you actually faced a computer and lost. Do you think that eventually the human mind will win or lose such future battles?
A: Oh yeah, the human mind is superior if you match it with a computer. But if you match it with a computer and the system behind it, that's a different story ... In simple terms, it was a socially great experiment; I'm still a great proponent of such an experiment, I believe that it should be done on a professional basis ... And I believe that IBM - without going into the details of them cheating during the match - I think that IBM cheated all of mankind.
Q: Why didn't you sue them?
A: IBM? IBM?
Q: Yes, why not?
A: I tell you I had many interviews and television interviews and none of them was carried in a proper form, because IBM buys too much advertising. To get what? That they cheated me and that they didn't give me a printout? Can you find a qualified jury to understand what I am talking about?
Q: Are you superstitious?
A: A little bit superstitious. But it's just a matter of habit. I like "13." I was born on April 13, and I was the 13th world champion.
Q: Are you good at predicting people's future moves?
A: Not as good as in chess. But I rely on my first impression; it's good nine times out of 10. But it took many years for me to recognize that a first impression is important.
Q: Do you believe in God?
A: Well, I'm not an atheist.
Q: What are you then?
A: Hard to say, because I don't like religion and I don't like confessions.
I think it was never meant to be so politicized, which makes me very, very uncomfortable. But I would say that I am with some reservations a Christian, and I believe that we are ruled by some higher power.
Q: How much longer are you going to play?
A: Well, my son is nearly two years old and he should see his father defending his title. In three years, he will understand. So I have at least three years to go.
Q: Do you ever play checkers?
A: Professionally, you mean?
Q: No, just for fun.
A: Oh yeah, I play all the table games for fun.
More recently, his unsuccessful face-off against the IBM-designed Deep Blue super computer ended in controversy when Kasparov stormed away from the match. He claims Deep Blue was a fraud - a puppet manipulated by human masters. In the meantime, IBM has dismantled Deep Blue.
Away from chess, Kasparov has been active on a number of other fronts. A native of Azerbaijan, Kasparov continues to live in Moscow, and is a frequent - and very public - commentator on Russia's political and economic dramas. He has also been advising international banking houses on developments in Russia. For some time, he appeared publicly to be flirting with greater involvement in politics - he has been an open supporter of nationalist politician Gen. Alexander Lebed - but now says he has changed his mind. Last week, Kasparov shared some of his thoughts on Russia, its politicians and reformers, and his life above the chess board with Prague Business Journal reporter (and chess know-nothing) Hana Le‰enarová. Following are excerpts of their conversation.
Q: In a recent Wall Street Journal article you compared Russian President Boris Yeltsin's government and the oligarchy to Al Capone & Co. Do you think that since you are who you are, you can get away with it?
A: No, I feel that it's my obligation to tell people in the civilized world what is happening in Russia. I did it 10 years ago, when Mikhail Gorbachev was begging for money and many people in the West were so charmed by him. And I had my reputation, I was already a world champion, and I was known as a proponent of democracy ... That's when I began writing. Now you have the so-called young reformers, who are selling the bullshit in the West that Russia is underway to reform and if you have these guys it will change. They say: Reforms are stolen in Russia; Russia now is on the way back. I am going to continue asking the same questions. And I believe that my articles would help Russian people because it will probably shorten the time of these crooks in power.
Q: What's your projection for Russia?
A: I think that it will happen by default. Because there is one good thing about what happened: There is no one else to blame. And I think the key basic problem was that they were portraying themselves as Democrats. Yeltsin and (former Prime Minister Viktor) Chernomyrdin and the clique - they did such a bad service to democracy. To the whole name. When you say democrat in Russia, people go grrrr (snarls like an angry dog). Because they associate it with those who were enriching themselves by robbing the whole country.
Q: What about all these former communists who are in the new Yevgeny Primakov government?
A: Now, they have to face a dilemma. Because these communists, these are not winning-type communists. They are cruel, but they are not brutal and they are not enemies. They have bank accounts in the West, they have a very different perspective.
Q: Where do you think is a safe place to keep your money?
A: Obviously, even New York is not the safest place, but again you can lose money in New York, in London, or Switzerland. But at least you know the rules and you can make some predictions. In Russia, whoever owes money, just because there is a new guy in the Kremlin, can simply default on all his obligations. And you know, I'm a chess player; I'm not a poker player. I have to count on some rules, then I can make predictions.
Q: What did you think of the financial community's excitement about Russia recently?
A: I think eventually Russia will have to consider a way to pay (its debts) back, but it's a question of correctly projected international pressure. There is a problem that Western leaders are too opportunistic.
Q: Well, what should they do? What kind of pressure are you talking about?
A: First of all, I don't think they should feel blackmailed by the nuclear threat. That's a very important point.
Q: You don't see that as anything the world should be worried about?
A: I think that the West should recognize that they are still dealing with people who are not serious negotiators. They can deny any deal, if such is the party line today. Party line, oligarchy line, tycoons' line, whatever you name it. They have a class interest, an interest in the elite and from their point of view, that's superior to any international criticisms ... And you have (former Prime Minister Sergei) Kiriyenko and you have (former Deputy Prime Minister Yegor) Gaidar to make declarations - one to Russians, one to the foreigners. And then they are replaced.
Q: Who do you consider an ideal politician to run Russia?
A: You don't have one. I am not an optimist. But I like Boris Fyodorov very much. He has been my personal friend for many years, and he is well placed; he is in the tax office ... He is young, experienced in the West, but the time for his generation hasn't come yet. You still have Yeltsin, Chernomyrdin, Primakov. They simply don't understand the elementary roots of the economy. They believe that two-times-two depends on the decision of the central committee or government or whatever.
Q: What about your plans to go into politics? Is that still an issue?
A: It's the least-productive area. I think that I can play chess, I can write articles, I can make some good assessments. But I should stay away from politics in Russia ... I declined a few times a proposition to run for Parliament.
Q: Well, let's assume you keep your job. Do you still have fun doing it?
A: It's work. It's creative work, and I need it for my soul satisfaction. Everything that I do is enhanced while I'm playing chess. But of course during this match I spent too much time watching CNN: Mr. Primakov and Mr. Clinton. But watching Clinton is for fun, watching Primakov is not for fun.
Q: What's your recipe for Primakov now?
A: I think transparency is the key factor. There is no single economy that will succeed unless there is transparency - whether it's Japan, South Korea, Indonesia - it would blow up. Most successful economies are the ones with transparent political and social systems ... where people can know whatever their president is doing.
Q: During the Deep Blue match you actually faced a computer and lost. Do you think that eventually the human mind will win or lose such future battles?
A: Oh yeah, the human mind is superior if you match it with a computer. But if you match it with a computer and the system behind it, that's a different story ... In simple terms, it was a socially great experiment; I'm still a great proponent of such an experiment, I believe that it should be done on a professional basis ... And I believe that IBM - without going into the details of them cheating during the match - I think that IBM cheated all of mankind.
Q: Why didn't you sue them?
A: IBM? IBM?
Q: Yes, why not?
A: I tell you I had many interviews and television interviews and none of them was carried in a proper form, because IBM buys too much advertising. To get what? That they cheated me and that they didn't give me a printout? Can you find a qualified jury to understand what I am talking about?
Q: Are you superstitious?
A: A little bit superstitious. But it's just a matter of habit. I like "13." I was born on April 13, and I was the 13th world champion.
Q: Are you good at predicting people's future moves?
A: Not as good as in chess. But I rely on my first impression; it's good nine times out of 10. But it took many years for me to recognize that a first impression is important.
Q: Do you believe in God?
A: Well, I'm not an atheist.
Q: What are you then?
A: Hard to say, because I don't like religion and I don't like confessions.
I think it was never meant to be so politicized, which makes me very, very uncomfortable. But I would say that I am with some reservations a Christian, and I believe that we are ruled by some higher power.
Q: How much longer are you going to play?
A: Well, my son is nearly two years old and he should see his father defending his title. In three years, he will understand. So I have at least three years to go.
Q: Do you ever play checkers?
A: Professionally, you mean?
Q: No, just for fun.
A: Oh yeah, I play all the table games for fun.
